WDB GIVEN ROUTING THAT WAS INCORRECT TO START WITH; THEN GIVEN ROUTING WHICH WOULD PUT ACFT INTO ADVERSE WX CONDITIONS. FLT CREW UNABLE TO COMPLY WITH ATC CLRNC WAS SENT TO VOR FOR HOLDING UNTIL FURTHER ROUTING COULD BE COORDINATED.

1988-05 · NASA ASRS report 87453

Date: 1988-05 · Aircraft: Widebody; Low Wing; 3 Turbojet Eng

Anomalies: deviation-discrepancy-procedural-clearance|inflight-event-encounter-weather-turbulence|other-unspecified

Synopsis

WDB GIVEN ROUTING THAT WAS INCORRECT TO START WITH; THEN GIVEN ROUTING WHICH WOULD PUT ACFT INTO ADVERSE WX CONDITIONS. FLT CREW UNABLE TO COMPLY WITH ATC CLRNC WAS SENT TO VOR FOR HOLDING UNTIL FURTHER ROUTING COULD BE COORDINATED.

Narrative

WE HAD ARRIVED AT EWR ABOUT AN HOUR BEFORE OUR DEP ON FLT AND HAD BEEN VECTORED AROUND SOME TRW'S ABOUT 40 MI W OF (BWZ) BROADWAY; SO WE KNEW THAT THERE WAS WX W OF THE ARPT; BUT AS WE ARE SO ACCUSTOMED TO NOW DAYS WE EXPECTED WE WOULD GET VECTORS OR CLRNC AROUND IT OR IT WOULD JUST DISSIPATE. ON OUR INITIAL CALL UP FOR A CLRNC FOR EWR TO STC. WE WERE CLRED AS FILED WITH A EWR 1 TO ELIOT INTXN. WHILE TAXIING OUT WE WERE TOLD TO CONTACT CLRNC AGAIN FOR A NEW CLRNC BECAUSE SWAP WAS IN EFFECT. WE CONTACTED CLRNC AND WERE GIVEN THE FOLLOWING CLRNC: EWR 1-PARKE-J288-LRP-J80-KIPPI-J110-IND-BRUSH 1-STL. AFTER LOOKING AT OUR MAPS IT WAS EVIDENT WE COULD NOT GO FROM LRP TO KIPPI VIA J80 BECAUSE J80 DOESN'T GO BTWN LRP AND KIPPI. WE QUESTIONED THE CLRNC AND WERE THEN ISSUED THIS CLRNC: EWR 1-PARKE-J228-LRP-J6-J149-J110-IND-BRUSH 1-STL. THIS AT LEAST WAS A CLRNC WE COULD ACCEPT. OUR TKOF WAS APPROX XXX LCL TIME AND I WILL TRY TO RECONSTRUCT THE SEQUENCE OF EVENTS TO THE BEST OF MY RECOLLECTION. AFTER OUR INITIAL TURN TO 190 DEGS AS PER DEP PROC ON RWY 22 AT EWR WE WERE TOLD TO CONTACT DEP CTL. WE DID AND WERE GIVEN A 270 DEG HDG AND CLB CLRNC TO 7000 OR 8000'. SHORTLY WE WERE TURNED OVER TO ANOTHER CTLR AND TOLD TO CLB TO 10000' AND TURN RIGHT TO 360 DEG HDG. OUR WX RADAR WAS PAINTING WX (TRWS) AND WE WERE NOT ABOUT TO BE VECTORED INTO THE WX (THIS WAS THE SAME STUFF THAT WE HAD COME THROUGH ON OUR ARR TO EWR). WE TOLD THE CTLR WE COULD NOT ACCEPT A 360 DEG HDG AND WOULD LIKE TO MAINTAIN OUR 270 DEG HDG; THIS WOULD KEEP US CLR OF THE WX. THE CTLR TOLD US WE COULD NOT MAINTAIN OUR 270 DEG HDG BECAUSE OF LGA TFC. HE TOLD US HE WOULD NOT GIVE US ANY MORE VECTORS. TOLD US TO GO BACK TO OUR LAST CTLR AND DSND TO 7000 OR 8000'. WHEN WE CONTACTED THE PREVIOUS CTLR HE COULD NOT VECTOR US AROUND EITHER AND TOLD US WE COULD HOLD SOMEWHERE OR GO BACK TO THE ARPT. WE TOLD HIM WE WOULD HOLD UNTIL WE COULD GET VECTORS AROUND THE WX. AT THIS TIME WE WERE STILL E OF SBJ (SOLBERG) AND WERE CLRD TO HOLD E 1 MIN OR 10 MI LEGS. JUST AS WE STARTED OUR RIGHT TURN TO ENTER THE HOLD AT SBJ; THE CTLR TOLD US WE COULD MAKE LEFT TURNS IF WE WANTED TO BECAUSE OF WX TO OUR RIGHT (AN INDICATION THAT HE WAS AWARE OF WX N OF US). BEFORE WE COMPLICATED OUR OUTBND TURN; WE WERE CLRED DIRECT PTW; DIRECT LRP FLT PLAN ROUTE. AT LAST WE HAD A CLRNC THAT AVOIDED ALL THE WX AND OUR DEP FROM THEN ON WAS CLR OF WX. OBSERVATIONS: SWAP IN THIS CASE DID NOT PROVIDE A SATISFACTORY DEP FOR WX AVOIDANCE. OUR FIRST SWAP CLRNC WAS INCORRECT AND COULD NOT BE COMPLIED WITH. EACH CTLR'S AIRSPACE WAS SO LIMITED IT PRECLUDED ANY SPACE FOR VECTORING. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 87465: NEWARK HANDED US TO NY CENTER; WHO TOLD US TO TURN RIGHT TO 360 DEGS. INFORMED CTLR WE COULDN'T--IT WOULD TAKE US INTO THE TSTMS WHICH BY NOW WERE LESS THAN 5 MI AWAY ON OUR RADAR. LIGHTNING AND LIGHT TO MODERATE TURB CONFIRMED THEIR POS. THE NY CTLR THEN INFORMED US WE COULDN'T CHANGE OUR ROUTING IN FLT--IF WE COULDN'T TAKE HIS VECTORS WE COULD RETURN TO EWR AND LAND. A BRIEF; FRUITLESS DISCUSSION FOLLOWED THIS RATHER ASTOUNDING PIECE OF NEWS. WE THEN SWITCHED BACK TO EWR DEP WHO CLRED US TO 8000'. WE WERE THEN OFFERED A HOLDING PATTERN E OF POTTSTOWN VOR ON THE 090 DEG R; RIGHT TURNS. THE CTLR ASKED IF WE COULD ACCEPT A 060 DEG HDG. WE CONCURRED; WERE GIVEN CLB CLRNC NEGOTIATED AN 075 DEG HDG TO KEEP OUT OF THE WX AND WERE GIVEN ANOTHER RIGHT TURN DIRECT MODENA VOR. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 87655: WE RETURNED TO PREVIOUS FREQ AND WAS GIVEN CLRNC TO HOLD AT SOLBERG TILL ATC COULD WORK SOMETHING OUT. AFTER PART OF A TURN WE WERE GIVEN CLRNC THAT KEPT US AWAY FROM TSTMS. WE ACCEPTED NEW CLRNC AND PROCEEDED TO STL.

Source: NASA Aviation Safety Reporting System (public domain). Reports are voluntary submissions and are not verified by NASA.

Loading the flight search…

Frequently asked questions

How do I search flights by aircraft type on FlightFinder?

Pick an aircraft model — Boeing 737, Airbus A320, A380, Boeing 787 Dreamliner and more — enter your origin airport, and FlightFinder shows every route that plane flies from there with live fares.

Which aircraft types can I filter by?

We support Boeing 737/747/757/767/777/787, the full Airbus A220/A319/A320/A321/A330/A340/A350/A380 family, Embraer E170/E175/E190/E195, Bombardier CRJ and Dash 8, and the ATR 42/72 turboprops.

Is FlightFinder free to use?

Search and schedules are free. Pro ($4.99/month, $39/year, or $99 one-time lifetime) unlocks the enriched flight card — on-time stats, CO₂ per passenger, amenities, live gate & weather — plus My Trips with push alerts.

Where does the route data come from?

Live schedules come from Amadeus, AeroDataBox and Travelpayouts. Observed routes (which aircraft actually flew a given city pair) are crowdsourced from adsb.lol ADS-B data under the Open Database License.