ACR MLG FAILED TO COMPLY WITH POM 1 SID RESTRICTIONS. FLT CREW BELIEVED THAT ASSIGNMENT OF MAINTAIN ALT CANCELLED SID RESTRICTIONS.

1988-05 · NASA ASRS report 87910

Date: 1988-05 · Aircraft: Medium Large Transport; Low Wing; 2 Turbojet Eng · Phase: climb

Anomalies: deviation-altitude-crossing-restriction-not-met|deviation-altitude-overshoot|deviation-discrepancy-procedural-clearance|deviation-discrepancy-procedural-published-material-policy

Synopsis

ACR MLG FAILED TO COMPLY WITH POM 1 SID RESTRICTIONS. FLT CREW BELIEVED THAT ASSIGNMENT OF MAINTAIN ALT CANCELLED SID RESTRICTIONS.

Narrative

ONT CLRNC DELIVERY CLRED US POM 1 DEP AS FILED; 12000'; EXPECT FL330(?) 10 MINS AFTER DEPART. THE F/O AND I DISCUSSED THE CLB RESTRICTION ON POM 1 AND AGREED THE 12000' REMOVED THE SID RESTRICTIONS. WHEN TURNED OVER TO DEP; RPTED 8300' FOR 12000'. DEP QUESTIONED OUR ALT; ASKED IF WE WEREN'T TOLD TO COMPLY WITH CLB RESTRICTIONS BY CLRNC DELIVERY AND ORDERED US BACK TO 7000'. I SAID WE WERE CLRED TO 12000'; POM 1; AND THAT DELETED THE CLB RESTRICTIONS. LATER CALLED DEP BACK; ASKED FOR TELEPHONE NUMBER AND CALLED SUPVR WHEN I ARRIVED IN SFO. IT WAS A FRIENDLY DISCUSSION; NO APPARENT CONFLICT. SUPVR INDICATED THEY WERE TRYING TO GET CLRNC DELIVERY TO INCLUDE PHRASE IN CLRNC: 'COMPLY WITH CLB RESTRICTIONS.' ALSO; ALERT AIRLINE OPERATORS TO POTENTIAL PROBS. WE MADE THE MISTAKE OF MAKING AN ASSUMPTION INSTEAD OF CALLING CLRNC DELIVERY FOR CLARIFICATION. THE CAPT I TURNED ACFT OVER TO IN SFO HAD MADE THE SAME MISTAKE THE DAY BEFORE! CONCLUSION: I DON'T THINK I WOULD HAVE MADE THAT ASSUMPTION IF THE CLRED ALT (12000') WERE ON THE POM 1 PAGE. ALSO MOST OF OUR CLB RESTRICTIONS ARE AT OR ABOVE; RATHER THAN BELOW. MANY; IF NOT MOST; OF OUR DEPS TODAY HAVE THE CLRED ALT ON THE PAGE; CONSEQUENTLY NO ALT IS INCLUDED IN THE CLRNC EXCEPT HIGHER AFTER 10 MINS; ETC (IE; ORD; DEN; ETC). I THINK THAT WOULD BE THE SUREST WAY TO AVOID THIS TYPE OF MISUNDERSTANDING. ALSO; MOST OF OUR XING RESTRICTIONS ARE AT OR ABOVE; CREATING A FURTHER TRAP. SUPPLEMENTAL INFO FROM ACN 87912: THE CAPT AND I REVIEWED THE DEP PROC IN DETAIL AND CONCURRED THAT THE CLRNC TO 12000' OBVIATED THE ALT RESTRICTION OF 7000' OR BELOW AT KARYN INTXN. WE EVEN TALKED ABOUT THAT AND THEN PROCEEDED TO REMOVE THE ALT RESTRICTION AT KARYN FROM THE FMC. ON CLBOUT; 2 NM SE OF KARYN INTXN AT 8300' MSL; DEP CLT (ONT) INFORMED US WE WERE TO CROSS KARYN INTXN AT 7000' MSL OR BELOW AND TO DSND BACK TO 7000'; WHICH WE DID. THE CAPT IMMEDIATELY CALLED THE ATC SUPVR AT ONT DEP CTL. ATC SUPVR SAID THERE WAS NO TFC CONFLICT WITH OUR ACFT; BUT ALSO ACKNOWLEDGED THE FACT THAT THERE WERE A NUMBER OF ACFT IN THE PAST WHICH WERE FLOWN THROUGH THE ALT CONSTRAINT AT KARYN INTXN; INDICATING THE SAME MISUNDERSTANDING/GRAY AREA EXISTED WITH THOSE FLT CREWS.

Source: NASA Aviation Safety Reporting System (public domain). Reports are voluntary submissions and are not verified by NASA.

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